Yes, it's serious...

For years there's been a growing movement within the Roman Catholic Church calling for the ordination of women to the priesthood. Donna Steichen has documented that movement in her classic, Ungodly Rage: The Hidden Face of Catholic Feminism.

One part of this movement is Womens Ordination Conference which recently put out this original musical composition titled, "Ordain a Lady."

Filed on YouTube under "Nonprofits & Activism," cheers!

Tim Bayly

Tim serves Clearnote Church, Bloomington, Indiana. He and Mary Lee have five children and fifteen grandchildren.

Comments

Who needs Paul the Apostle when you have Carly Rae Jepsen!

I saw this yesterday, following Rod Dreher on Twitter. When I got home from work, I described the foolishness to my wife, then we had a good, if inconclusive, discussion on toleration of rebellion (i.e. "having the conversation") within families, and institutions, and whether the toleration of rebellion today makes dissolution (or fundamental transformation) inevitable tomorrow. We couldn't decide whether the tolerated existence of such a movement in the RCC means that women will inevitably someday be ordained as priests.

We did conclude, though, that in Evangelical churches, toleration of "having the conversation" does invariably result in the eventual acceptance of rebellion.

The RCC has long tolerated, unofficially, lots of perversion. But they never budged for Wycliffe, Huss, Pascal, and their blessed ilk. But I digress.

Did I really just watch that whole thing?

Reminds me of high school.

I'm thinking that if this is indicative of the mental processes and spiritual growth of those endorsing women in the pulpit, I'd be glad to use this as an argument AGAINST the same.

Taylor, you're tougher, or more of a glutton for punishment, than I.  :^)

" ... I'd be glad to use this as an argument AGAINST [women's ordination]"

I originally saw this on a Roman blog.  In reading the comments, I discovered that some commenters initially thought that the video was created in order to lampoon and to agitate against women's ordination to the Roman priesthood.  These commenters were horrified and stupified to learn that the video was serious!

Another commenter made an observation that may or may not be true of similar femmes within evangelicalism, to wit -- that from watching this video, you'd think the Roman church was awash in young women just dying to get into the priesthood, while the truth is otherwise. To paraphrase the commenter: "All the ones I know are single women of a certain age."

I was coerced into watching this after much bullying on FB and via email.  Five minutes of my life I'll never get back. I just have 2 responses:

1) She's not a lady

2) Precisely which "church" does she want back"?

From everything I've ever heard, this sort of thing does not at all represent "having the conversation" within the Roman Catholic church. These are malcontents sniping from the sidelines, without ever receiving any quarter from the established authority. And doing it risibly badly, for that matter.

some commenters initially thought that the video was created in order to lampoon and to agitate against women's ordination to the Roman priesthood.

Exactly what my sister had initially thought!

I likewise thought it was a joke. Finding that it was a real attempt is deliciously funny.  It also made me think though about the tune, which was actually catchy and I could not believe that the masterminds behind this were capable.  Then I thought about the title.  This is actually a play-off of a viral much-parodied YouTube video "Call Me Maybe". I looked it up and it is basically about a young woman lusting after her neighbor only to find that he is a sodomite.  just thought I would point out the quality content they seek to emulate in case it was lost on any of us. 

The video has a bit of integrity: “Woman priest is my call, women preaching for all, don’t listen to Saint Paul.” There it is simple and direct: You can ordain women or you can follow the Bible. You can't do both.

On the other hand, the video included the common misrepresentation that nearly everyone else is doing it. The vast majority of Christians in the history of the world (including the vast majority of Christians alive today) have belonged to churches that restrict ordination to men. That doesn't prove that this is what we should be doing, but it would be helpful if those advocating for women's ordination would have the honesty to admit how radical their position is instead of pretending that there is just a tiny group of fundamentalists who disagree with them.

I am with David on that one!  That particular lyric made me think it was a joke.  As I have talked with friends, family, and acquaintances from the Episcopal Church I grew up in--who are on the liberal side--I have concluded that the unbridgeable wall between myself and them is our view of the Bible.  There is the view that the word of God has authority and we must subject our lives to it, and there is the view that the word of God is, well, not the word of God, but a thing to be parsed and cherrypicked, and I can't call that belief Christianity.  The minute you say "well, I don't agree with that" about bible teaching rather than "I don't understand that" or "I wish that wasn't so, but there it is," you have stepped into mortal danger.

Another couple of thoughts on this: first, what's with the rainbow frocks?  Isn't that a form of mocking the Church that ought to earn someone a few Hail Marys and a few drinks of holy water after Confession?  I'm not Catholic, but just sayin'.

Also, with the huge issues with priests taking sexual advantage of young parishioners, what's with the mini-plaid skirts?  Apparently, these women (?) think that enabling some mens' festishes for shortened uniforms from Catholic girls' schools is an argument for their ordination.  What could possibly go wrong, after all?

Most of the rank-and-file Roman Catholics I know are neutral about women's ordination. They aren't opposed to it, but they don't feel like the status quo must be maintained at all costs. A few would like women to be ordained but don't do anything to advance this cause.

On the other hand, I have been surprised with the authority that women can hold in the RC church and/or its ministries. They can be:

  • parish administrators (sometimes nuns who hold down the fort in a parish who must share a priest with 1 or 2 other parishes)
  • youth ministers
  • ministers of music
  • ministers of Christian formation
  • Bible teachers
  • teachers in the RCIA program (the program for adult converts to the RC church)
  • teachers in programs on RC radio stations (not just at programs aimed at women)
  • teachers of theology in RC colleges and universities (even ones that still hold on to RC teaching/faith)

I've learned some of this from RC church members, but also from our local RC station which acquired a pretty strong AM frequency roughly a year ago. Their theology is very orthodox RC. As an Anglican, I don't agree with everything they broadcast, but I listen to many of their programs when I'm in my car. Their content has much more depth than our local evangelical Christian radio station, at least as in this listener's opinion.

P.S. Sorry if I bored anyone who already knew the non-ordained leadership positions open to women in the RC church.

Hi Bert,

What do you mean by "rainbow frocks"? 

If you mean the outer garment that looks like a poncho that the two women who want to be ordained are wearing, that is a chasuble. Here's a definition from Wikipedia:

The chasuble is the outermost liturgical vestment worn by clergy for the celebration of the Eucharist in Western-tradition Christian Churches that use full vestments, primarily in the Roman CatholicAnglican and Lutheran[1]churches, as well as in some parts of the United Methodist Church.

The chasuble's color coincides with the liturgical seasons of the church year. As far as I know, the woman with the blue chasuble might be wearing the correct color for a season of the church year; the one with the olive one; I'm not sure. 

Here are two links for more information:

Chasuble: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chasuble

Liturgical colors: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liturgical_colours

This will give you a basic idea. It can be more complicated, but I won't go there. Maybe Fr. Bill will.

Hope this helps,

Sue

It makes you wonder why they want ordained. What is the draw for these women to be ordained to teach a Bible they do not, by their own confession, believe?

I'm not against liturgical clothing, but in this case, the perfect accoutrement for this message and that ensemble would have been a pointy tail and a pitchfork. And Simon Magus on keyboard.

"Don't listen to St. Paul, 'cause I can lead the way..."

Wow. Directly repudiating the apostolic message and messenger? Back away!

Then the LORD spoke to Moses, saying, "Speak to the congregation, saying, 'Get back from around the dwellings of Korah, Dathan and Abiram.'"

Thanks for the pointer, Sue.  It's admittedly been a while since I've been a part of any "high church" church, and that was Methodist during my youth. 

That said, I'm still thinking that impersonating the vestments has got to be something "not exactly encouraged" in that set of traditions.  No?

Hi Bert,

I'm not sure what you mean by "impersonating the vestments". The general style and decoration on the chasubles on the women on the video don't seem too far out of line from what I've seen in Anglican churches. 

If you mean wearing vestments including the chasuble, which the priest or minister puts on only to celebrate the Eucharist, then I could see this as mocking the Sacrament that RC women can't preside over.

This wannabe 'Woman Priest' would still have to make it through the M.Div gauntlet. But according to St. Paul, the RCC pipeline remains populated by men only. If she has an M.Div, it's from a Protestant seminary ...

Reformed seminaries violated the Apostle Paul decades ago. Feminism and egalitarianism run rampant in these seminaries, especially by the Ph.Ds. It's only a matter of time before the first PCA 'Woman Preacher' ascends to the pulpit. Any bets who and when?

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